Tricky reversing

Any comments, questions, stories about HR 29, this is the right place.
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Re: Tricky reversing

Postby Merihelmi » Mon Jan 06, 2014 1:29 pm

Thanks guys for sharing your experience. I also tried to use ropes and this helps and is usable when we are two on the boat. Next summer i will train and test different methods and become more familiar with how Merihelmi behaves.

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Re: Tricky reversing

Postby charlienog » Thu Jan 16, 2014 2:49 pm

Hi, this problem is not limited to the R29. I'm a sailing newbie and find manoeuvring at low speed into and out of the marina (which is tightly packed with expensive yachts) to be one of the more difficult aspects of sailing. I'm part way thru' "Manoeuvring at Close Quarters Under Power" by Bill Johnson (available as ebook from Amazon) and expect to get the hang of it with practise and a better understanding of the issues.

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Re: Tricky reversing

Postby Antti_DD » Thu Jan 16, 2014 10:34 pm

Hi charlienog and welcome to the forum! You are right, the tricky reversing is not limited just to HR29, but I guess that pretty much all the boats with a traditional hull shape and long keel (or long fin-keel in case of HR 29) have not so good maneuvering abilities on reverse. I sometimes envy those modern boats which seem to handle like cars on reverse. On the other hand, I feel that HR29 is pretty easy boat to drive to the berth due to the good directional stability as it is less likely to start wandering sideways even in stronger crosswinds.

Thanks for the book tip, I got to check it out!
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HR 29 # 483 "Dolphin Dance"
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Re: Tricky reversing

Postby tomblix » Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:12 am

Compensating with the bow-thruster does the trick.
Aren`t all HR29 fitted with a thruster? I thought that was part of the package….?
Best regards from Tom

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Re: Tricky reversing

Postby Antti_DD » Mon Feb 10, 2014 10:32 pm

Hi Tom, I think that there is not many HR29s with a bow-thruster out there. I've maybe once seen a sales ad of one 29, which had a bow thruster. However, given the difficulty of maneuvering the boat in tight places, I can definitely see the rationale behind it. I actually considered installing a bow thruster after the first season, until I found about their prices. Do you have the water tank still located below the fore cabin V-berth? Does installing the bow thruster require modifications to the original construction?
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HR 29 # 483 "Dolphin Dance"
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Re: Tricky reversing

Postby tomblix » Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:37 am

Hi
I`m much surprised to hear that bow-thrusters are rare on our beautiful boats….
Actually - I don`t think I´ve ever seen a HR without one. But then again - the HR29 is rare in itself, and maybe I`ve just been thinking that whats normal on bigger boats are normal on ours. A proof that the inductive method is unreliable!
Regarding the water tank - yes, I have the tank below the birth in the fore cabin. Room enough, but I don`t have a separate battery for the thruster, its wired back to the domestic bank. Might be a problem with a separate one - I don`t know. In my opinion its not really necessary with a separate battery, I only use the thruster when the engine`s running, so….

The above makes me think of something that I´ve been wondering about. When we bought Lina, she had a big sack of sand in the bow under the birth as extra weight. There`s also one in the storage room on the right side under the birth in the cabin. My guess is that each of them weigh around 25 kg. Does anyone else have the same? Are our boats that poorly balanced? I haven`t removed them, but in principal I would like to. The one on the right side will certainly be removed when I install the new batteries. But how about the one in the bow?
Best regards from Tom

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Re: Tricky reversing

Postby Antti_DD » Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:46 pm

Tom, I cannot really see the idea behind having extra weight in the bow. To my knowledge, weight located far away from the boat's center of gravity is not a very good thing in terms of sailing performance. That said, we have an anchor, anchor windlass and 40 meters of chain in the bow, so obviously this, together with the full water tank, puts quite a lot of weight in the bow. Well, fortunately the 29 is pretty sturdy boat, so that extra weight is perhaps less crucial than in a lighter and more performance oriented boat. The anchoring gear has obviously some other benefits, so I am ready to accept slightly reduced sailing performance for the sake of easier cruising. However, I don't see the point for having weight in the bow in the form of sand sacks. Most probably there is some reason for those however... Just a guess, has your boat been equipped with a heavy bow anchoring gear previously. If the waterline was painted based on that weight, maybe the sacks are compensating for that. To my knowledge, HR paints the waterline individually for each boat, based on the equipment that she has.
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Re: Tricky reversing

Postby tomblix » Tue Feb 11, 2014 9:06 pm

Hi Anti

Interesting theory about the waterline. I don`t know, but I´ll check. Odds are that I`ll remove the sand…..
Best regards from Tom

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Re: Tricky reversing

Postby pnp » Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:54 am

Indeed an interesting comment about the waterline! Didn't know that! Even if that is the case though, removing the sacks would only expose more paint which is not a problem and at the same time it will reduce pitching which is something you do want. Theoretically, having the anchor gear, water tank, etc at the bow is bad enough, but it at least provides you with some value.

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Re: Tricky reversing

Postby Naseimwind » Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:44 am

I am regularly in the Harbour of Terschelling. The Kay’s are U-shaped an you lay in packs always alongside the legs of the U. That leaves a narrow alley in the middle of the U. As you always have to moore in outbound direction I had several times to go in backward through that narrow alley. According to my experience it is best to gain some speed backwards with the rudder in central position. That does not require to head already into your final direction. Then you reduce thrust significantly and steer with moderate rudder movements. You have a lot of pressure. If it is very strong you are too fast and the boat will be uncontrollable. I have the engine normally just coupled in rear without additional gas. It is very important to move the rudder back to center position much earlier than going foreword as the momentum of the boat carries on longer. Due to the turning direction of my propeller going backward larboard curves are easier and more direct steering than starboard curves. In tight situations you can correct with Short foreword thrusts, however, that is very tricky. I mainly use that for last corrections shortly before I am going to stop anyway.
In very tight or windy situations I do use ropes to support the steering as described in above posts. Here, backsprings for mooring and foresprings for unmooring, going from the middle clamp to the pole of the berth are most efficient. At low speed you do not need fenders as long as the pole is wooden.
In general I do maneuver with moderate speed, so the engine is just coupled in at lowest gas. Speed is corrected by shorter thrusts of the engine.

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